Curse

Azmodan · May 30, 2006, 05:24 PM // 17:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

Edit: Azmodan. Smiters can out damage eles quite easily, in the later missions anyway. The ridiculously high armour Jade/Mursaat bosses (180 base AL i think) get completely annihilated by smiters. Its not often you drop Cairn the Destroyer using henchman while Willia the Unpleasant is still alive.

Yeah! Well against the afflicted in the Unwaking Waters mission, he got owned. And owned very badly.

My point was about flexibility. Not all builds work for every situation. If a particular build isn't working for a particular mission, then change it.

Also, groups in the Deep will not take a Ranger unless he is a trapper.

Maria The Princess · May 31, 2006, 05:44 AM // 05:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

No-one cares how useful the skill is, they just assume that because you can clear out FoW as Barrage/Pet quicker than anyone else, that the skill is godly. That skill requires as much brains to use as a Fire ele. The number of times i've missed spells in B/P trips because im already using Barrage isn't much help. If you join as an interrupter, Barrage has no place, ever. Your either there for damage, or there to interrupt, you can't do both effectively. Even if the interrupts you throw out can dish out a decent amount of damage. The only time i might consider bringing along Barrage in a normal group is FoW for Judges Insight massacring of Skeletons (or low level missions).

Not many people i've seen want traps outside of UW and THK. The amount of time you spend waiting for trappers is a bit dull, you can just as easily bring Pin Down and not slow everyone down.

Edit: Azmodan. Smiters can out damage eles quite easily, in the later missions anyway. The ridiculously high armour Jade/Mursaat bosses (180 base AL i think) get completely annihilated by smiters. Its not often you drop Cairn the Destroyer using henchman while Willia the Unpleasant is still alive.

i agree barrage takes no brains to use, but if that's what takes for a ranger to get in a PUG, thats what it takes.

and btw, you cAN barrage and interrupt. bararge is 1 skill slot, not 5. i can easily carry savage shot and distracting shot along, AND have all stuff i need to survive aggro.

lol i feel your hate vs barrage, WHY? its a good skill, and trust me, in Cantha, 2 barrage/P rangers take down afflicted with no harm to self

and IMO, pin down is useless in PVE...

VGJustice · May 31, 2006, 06:36 AM // 06:36

Taking Savage/Distracting/Concusion along with Barrage is actually pretty standard. If you see that you need to Interrupt instead of spam Barrage, you stop spamming Barrage, pull out your Recurve bow, and interrupt.

And, yeah, Rangers have a tough time getting groups sometimes because they don't really have a defined role like many other classes. It was especially hard for my melee Ranger to find a group as I took him through Prophecies. Now I look at the groups that have no idea what a Ranger can and can't do (Hint: They're not limited to anything that I've seen) and I just move on. If they want to be close-minded, that's their problem.

Basic builds I've used that are effective: Barrage w/ Interrupts, B/P and spirits, Riposte tank builds, Poison spam builds (melee and ranged), pure support builds with interrupts, Trap happy builds, Minor traps with some ranged damage, Pet builds, and support/damage builds. Of all the characters I've played, the Ranger is the one that needs to skill to the area and the situation the most. A basic b/p will get you by just about anywhere, though.

Evilsod · May 31, 2006, 02:20 PM // 14:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maria The Princess

and btw, you cAN barrage and interrupt. bararge is 1 skill slot, not 5. i can easily carry savage shot and distracting shot along, AND have all stuff i need to survive aggro.

lol i feel your hate vs barrage, WHY? its a good skill, and trust me, in Cantha, 2 barrage/P rangers take down afflicted with no harm to self

and IMO, pin down is useless in PVE...

I think you misunderstood. Once you've started to use Barrage, you can't then instantly interrupt a spell that you could've done otherwise. You have to wait till Barrage is over first before you can do anything, i never said Barrage takes up 5 slots.

I don't have Factions, but surely anyone with a ranged attack or interrupts can take down things that need melee range targets or casters without any damage. 2 Rangers that have never even heard of barrage could take down an Afflicted by the sounds of it. Btw, are Afflicted the ones that explode after dieing?

Obviously you need to check again exactly how fast Skeleton Berserkers or Grasping Darkness can run. Those things are lethal, and you can't exactly catch them up and Throw Dirt on them to save your monk now can you? I'm not saying Pin Down is useful everywhere, but unless your using yourself as a decoy to lure things over traps, they do nothing but slow the group down.

Azmodan, i see your point. Keeping the same skill set for everything however useful it is is foolish. Although saying that i've kept about 7 skills the same on my ranger wherever i went with henchman and they worked everywhere

Lasher Dragon · May 31, 2006, 06:49 PM // 18:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zinger314

So, I recently made my Canthan born Ranger lv. 20. I have found for her a very nice bow.

However...Rangers, like Mesmers and Assassians, lack a nieche. Hence, it's difficult to get groups.

What's the best way to get groups as a Ranger. Just simply Barrage?

Yes, it's been said already in this thread, but I will add another voice saying be flexible. Learn at least 3 or 4 completely different ranger builds; write them down if you have to. Barrage/damage build, trap build, and interrupt build to start. Once you are comfortable with those 3 basic ranger builds, try some other ones - beastmastery, touch ranger, hell bunnythumper if that floats your boat. Get to the point where you know each build and can at least guess at the viability of any specific build in a particular map or mission. Then you can advertise a role that is desirable for the situation at hand.

I haven't had a problem finding a group with my ranger since like the first few months of Prophecies. Back then, rangers were treated about like assassins are now - although I think assassins have it worse.

SnipiousMax · May 31, 2006, 06:55 PM // 18:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lasher Dragon

Back then, rangers were treated about like assassins are now - although I think assassins have it worse.

There's just so many of them!

Ishmaeel · May 31, 2006, 10:15 PM // 22:15

I never have any trouble finding players with my R/Mo. Never takes more than 5 mins. I start my own groups. I never even advertise what I do (barrage, interrupt, whatever).

My tips:

* Advertise with witty lines. Don't just say "LFG". Say something like "R/X calling all would-be Protectors of Tyria for bonus only! (1/6)". Attracts the more sophisticated players.
* Advertise with willingness to use henchies. "R & E gonna own the Thunderhead Keep. Wanna tag along? We got henchie monks! :P (4/8)". Weeds out the n00.. err.. more narrow-minded players. Not to mention attracts the more sophisticated players.
* Exploit the human weaknesses

"Two sexy ranger girls looking for mission. Invite yourself if you think you can handle that :P (2/8)". Attracts all kinds of (smart and otherwise) people. Throw in the henchie line for a more finely tuned party

Edit: Oh BTW, the (3/8) part is important. It is valuable information for people who lurk the local chat for missions.

Post-Edit: Don't ever call "LF two more Monks for mission". I suspect the monks are irritated by it and if they were not drawn by your witty calls, they won't be lured by this either. If your party is up to (6/8) with no healers in sight, offer to take hench monks to your party. Kick anyone who objects ("OMFG n00b we need reel munks!") to make up more room and avoid a failed mission.

Evilsod · Jun 01, 2006, 12:55 AM // 00:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishmaeel

* Advertise with witty lines. Don't just say "LFG". Say something like "R/X calling all would-be Protectors of Tyria for bonus only! (1/6)". Attracts the more sophisticated players.
* Advertise with willingness to use henchies. "R & E gonna own the Thunderhead Keep. Wanna tag along? We got henchie monks! :P (4/8)". Weeds out the n00.. err.. more narrow-minded players. Not to mention attracts the more sophisticated players.
* Exploit the human weaknesses

"Two sexy ranger girls looking for mission. Invite yourself if you think you can handle that :P (2/8)". Attracts all kinds of (smart and otherwise) people. Throw in the henchie line for a more finely tuned party

Edit: Oh BTW, the (3/8) part is important. It is valuable information for people who lurk the local chat for missions.

Post-Edit: Don't ever call "LF two more Monks for mission". I suspect the monks are irritated by it and if they were not drawn by your witty calls, they won't be lured by this either. If your party is up to (6/8) with no healers in sight, offer to take hench monks to your party. Kick anyone who objects ("OMFG n00b we need reel munks!") to make up more room and avoid a failed mission.

Wow... i really hope no-one tries those tips. 1/6, that 1 might work, but calling for Bonus only normally gets the exact same affect if there are people around looking for the bonus.
4/8... just no, you don't add henchie monks until you've decided no-one can be arsed to wait for real ones. Besides anyone whos 'gonna own THK' sounds more like they don't have a clue whats going on.
2/8... No that i just ignore. The only thing i can see that getting is little kids or your type of wamma that does /dance infront of you when sat down.

Outside of FoW taking henchie monks is quite an obvious choice. I'd rather go for the 'LF 1 Healer 1 Prot monk for FoW' than the 'LF 2 1337 monkzorz to pwn FoW' anyday. Whats witty to you might not be to the people your trying to attract to your group, never forget that.

Snipious, you can hardly say that ever since Power of my Ranger began owning the HoH there hasn't been a MASSIVE increase in the number of rangers. Before that i hadn't actually seen a female ranger, very few male ones either. Now they're everywhere. Specially ToA/Tombs waiting for Barrage teams.

Age · Jun 01, 2006, 01:08 AM // 01:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zinger314

So, I recently made my Canthan born Ranger lv. 20. I have found for her a very nice bow.

However...Rangers, like Mesmers and Assassians, lack a nieche. Hence, it's difficult to get groups.

What's the best way to get groups as a Ranger. Just simply Barrage?

The best way as i have a R/N is to tell everyone who you are I always say Interrupt/Trapper LFG and usually get in.There is no proplem at level 20 at getting into groups if you have all the right skills.It is hard when you are at the lower levels this was especially true in Tryria missions.I would tell them what you just like a Necro has to do eg MM LFG or SS.

Saborath Gilgalad · Jun 01, 2006, 02:21 AM // 02:21

When I did Chapter 1 with my ranger (my first Charecter) I would waited for hours in some cases to get into groups for the missions, and I did do every mission with real people. Now however I just Hench the missions, Its Much Faster and almost every time I sucseed the first time I try. I still do sometime do missions with real people but being a ranger it takes Time and when I have about an hour to play before work or school I dont want to spend half that time waiting for a group. So thats why I hench it, and run, my standard pve ranger build. 2 interupts, Barrage, 2 Dmg skills, Troll, and WD.
There still is a sense of Ranger hate IMO in PvE and I dont know why the ranger is a very versitle and pve oriented class. There was a time when it was hard for Necro's to get into Pve groups but now thier a must have, hopfully rangers will have to day some times soon.

On a Side note, I always wanted to take a Mesmer through PvE, but In my experiences I found that mesmers had harder times geting into groups than rangers, and I never did it because I didnt want the hassel.

Maria The Princess · Jun 01, 2006, 03:50 AM // 03:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

I think you misunderstood. Once you've started to use Barrage, you can't then instantly interrupt a spell that you could've done otherwise. You have to wait till Barrage is over first before you can do anything, i never said Barrage takes up 5 slots.

I don't have Factions, but surely anyone with a ranged attack or interrupts can take down things that need melee range targets or casters without any damage. 2 Rangers that have never even heard of barrage could take down an Afflicted by the sounds of it. Btw, are Afflicted the ones that explode after dieing?

Obviously you need to check again exactly how fast Skeleton Berserkers or Grasping Darkness can run. Those things are lethal, and you can't exactly catch them up and Throw Dirt on them to save your monk now can you? I'm not saying Pin Down is useful everywhere, but unless your using yourself as a decoy to lure things over traps, they do nothing but slow the group down.

Azmodan, i see your point. Keeping the same skill set for everything however useful it is is foolish. Although saying that i've kept about 7 skills the same on my ranger wherever i went with henchman and they worked everywhere

when im in FOW partys i usualy tag along by the casters, with my throw dirt ready.

when "barraging", i dont just sit, wach TV and press 1... i LOOK. so if i see a mob that needs to be interrupted, like a mesmer, necro or a monk, i leave barrage alone for a while and concentrate on interrupting, when team needs more damage, i press that 1 button again.

jesh · Jun 01, 2006, 04:52 AM // 04:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyld Kard

Yeah being a ranger and trying to get into any random PUG is hard, because everyone is stuck on the Tank/Healer/MM/Nuker setup for most things best thing is eaither gain some friends, join a guild, or hench it.

I find it ironic to no one that the once-hated necro class no has a place in the holy trinity, after they got nerfed. 10 minions? What the heck? And people want them more than ever. I'll never understand the mind of the average GW player. I also thought it ironic that after the AoE nerf, SS necros instantly became the thing to be.

The way to get a group is simple. Start one, or better yet, have your monk friend start one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishmaeel

I never have any trouble finding players with my R/Mo. Never takes more than 5 mins. I start my own groups. I never even advertise what I do (barrage, interrupt, whatever).

My tips:

* Advertise with witty lines. Don't just say "LFG". Say something like "R/X calling all would-be Protectors of Tyria for bonus only! (1/6)". Attracts the more sophisticated players.
* Advertise with willingness to use henchies. "R & E gonna own the Thunderhead Keep. Wanna tag along? We got henchie monks! :P (4/8)". Weeds out the n00.. err.. more narrow-minded players. Not to mention attracts the more sophisticated players.
* Exploit the human weaknesses

"Two sexy ranger girls looking for mission. Invite yourself if you think you can handle that :P (2/8)". Attracts all kinds of (smart and otherwise) people. Throw in the henchie line for a more finely tuned party

Edit: Oh BTW, the (3/8) part is important. It is valuable information for people who lurk the local chat for missions.

Post-Edit: Don't ever call "LF two more Monks for mission". I suspect the monks are irritated by it and if they were not drawn by your witty calls, they won't be lured by this either. If your party is up to (6/8) with no healers in sight, offer to take hench monks to your party. Kick anyone who objects ("OMFG n00b we need reel munks!") to make up more room and avoid a failed mission.

I agree with everything said here. I will *not* join a group that just randomly invites me regardless of my character's class, regardless of how many monks they have. Also the bit about weeding out bad players is sound advice. Whether the motive is right or not, the logic is correct. An open minded team mate willing to cooperate is a hundred times more valuable than whatever specific build you're convinced you need for X mission.

SnipiousMax · Jun 01, 2006, 05:05 AM // 05:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

Snipious, you can hardly say that ever since Power of my Ranger began owning the HoH there hasn't been a MASSIVE increase in the number of rangers. Before that i hadn't actually seen a female ranger, very few male ones either. Now they're everywhere. Specially ToA/Tombs waiting for Barrage teams.

I'm not saying that!

I'm just saying there are a disproportionately large number of assassins in most PvE missions I've played lately. Groups will still take a Ranger over an assassin given the choice (not to say that Assassins are bad....just given a bad rep due to the large number of people that play them).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

I'd rather go for the 'LF 1 Healer 1 Prot monk for FoW' than the 'LF 2 1337 monkzorz to pwn FoW' anyday. Whats witty to you might not be to the people your trying to attract to your group, never forget that.

QFT

VGJustice · Jun 01, 2006, 05:33 AM // 05:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by jesh

I find it ironic to no one that the once-hated necro class no has a place in the holy trinity, after they got nerfed. 10 minions? What the heck? And people want them more than ever. I'll never understand the mind of the average GW player. I also thought it ironic that after the AoE nerf, SS necros instantly became the thing to be.

Well, that's easy. SS is why they're popular, and SS doesn't trigger AoE. Also, I dare you to say that a level 26 flesh golem isn't damn sexy. Too bad you can't have both at once.

Ishmaeel · Jun 01, 2006, 06:42 AM // 06:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

Wow... i really hope no-one tries those tips...

I'm "trying" these tips all the time and succeeding. I'm not blowing these out on this thread out off my ass.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

...1/6, that 1 might work, but calling for Bonus only normally gets the exact same affect if there are people around looking for the bonus.
4/8...

The party numbers and the actual calls are examples. I'm not saying simply typing "1/6" are gonna pull all the good players. And I'm saying if you are looking for bonus only, you're better off with players with the same intention. I'm not saying call for bonus when you are simply out for skill capping and leaving.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

just no, you don't add henchie monks until you've decided no-one can be arsed to wait for real ones.

For one, I can't be arsed to wait for real monks when everybody and their grampa is "looking for two monks", especially when there are no monks in the outpost (that's always a laugh). IMO, anyone who is "afraid" to depend on henchie monks needs to build better playing skills and self/team confidence. BTW, this line is attractive to monks too. Just the previous day a monk (a pretty good player, and a funny guy too) invited himself after I pulled the line with henchie monks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

Besides anyone whos 'gonna own THK' sounds more like they don't have a clue whats going on.

Did I mention I completed the THK on my first attempt with that exact line? Those who "dared" apply were great team players and fun people and the mission was a thrill. Also, we had to kick both Mhenlo and Lina because two monks (again, very good ones) invited themselves too. See above.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

2/8... No that i just ignore. The only thing i can see that getting is little kids or your type of wamma that does /dance infront of you when sat down.

Well, that one was actually 30% serious. Normally I would ignore it too. Its inclusion here is simply because it sometimes works

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

... I'd rather go for the 'LF 1 Healer 1 Prot monk for FoW' than the 'LF 2 1337 monkzorz to pwn FoW' anyday.

I do not disagree with that. If you are looking for specific builds/classes, by all means, advertise as such. However, you don't need specific class and/or team builds for normal missions -- only objectives such as effective farming require that. So I promote diversity and balance in the groups I form.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evilsod

...Whats witty to you might not be to the people your trying to attract to your group, never forget that.

"monkzorz to pwn" does not sound particularly witty to me, and I sure as hell hope it does not sound witty to anyone. When I say witty, I mean intelligent, humorous and informative. Thanks for the reminder though. I will "never forget that" some people might not appreciate what I consider intelligent, humorous and informative and those are the very ones I hope I'll never accidentally party up with.

Azmodan · Jun 01, 2006, 03:09 PM // 15:09

I agree with the witty posts. I also find much better groups that way. It also gets me more invites.

I play to have fun. If the group wipes 5 times, I don't care. IT'S A GAME! I would rather fail 100 times with a good group then succeed once with a miserable group. I'll even join groups that choose to go without a monk or with 1 other real person and the rest henchies.

AlbinoChocobo · Jun 01, 2006, 03:54 PM // 15:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Ketsu

Just remember to advertise what you do when you say Lfg. Rangers cant just say "Lfg" like warriors and monks can.

You have to say "Trap ranger Lfg" or "Barrage ranger Lfg" ect. ect. and then you will start to get invites.

I find the whole "class LFG" thing a bit ridiculous. Most classes are pretty versatile (yes, even warriors), so I'd rather call "boon prot LFG". Would have saved one of the lost PUGs I was in (3 monks, other 2 turned out to be a smiter and a 55). A shame people won't read longer annoncements too, LFG is so dull.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lasher Dragon

Learn at least 3 or 4 completely different ranger builds; write them down if you have to.

I write down my monk builds, no shame in that ..

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lasher Dragon

although I think assassins have it worse

I'll take anyone advertising "non tanking assassin LFG"

Bottom line is, you're not just a ranger. Show you know the game, flaunt what you can do. If all else fails, learn to dance like a female Ele, people will take you on for the fun of it (especially a male Ranger ..)

Quote:

Originally Posted by VGJustice

Also, I dare you to say that a level 26 flesh golem isn't damn sexy.

No. It isn't. I'm rather partial to female Necros myself, must be the outfit ("ooh, yeah, raise my lvl26 flesh golem") (note: that kind of 'witty call' may not work very well .. )

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishmaeel

We got henchie monks!

Find that hilarious. If you got flying monkey minipets I'll join anytime

Maria The Princess · Jun 02, 2006, 03:39 AM // 03:39

i got a samll book with all kinds of builds in it, for any proffession i play. i use maby 5% of them all, but its nice to have em if some1 asks me to go as that type

jesh · Jun 02, 2006, 05:56 AM // 05:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azmodan

I agree with the witty posts. I also find much better groups that way. It also gets me more invites.

I play to have fun. If the group wipes 5 times, I don't care. IT'S A GAME! I would rather fail 100 times with a good group then succeed once with a miserable group. I'll even join groups that choose to go without a monk or with 1 other real person and the rest henchies.

Yay someone that thinks like me! Sometimes I join groups just to see everyone fail. XD

Sometimes I'm that guy giving everyone miasma.. lol!
It's a game, you gotta have fun.

And I second the motion of a witty line being much more enticing than LF xxxx, or GFL more... blech.

blackbird71 · Jun 02, 2006, 10:18 PM // 22:18

How to get into a PvE group as a ranger? Like this:

1. Use henchies. There are few missions you can't do without other players. I beat Hell's Precipice with my ranger, henchies, and one other player after several attempts with full groups. I don't know how many times I've found the henchman AI to be smarter than the players in random PUGs.

2. Use friends. Real life and in game friends are always a great way to get a mission done, and they're more fun to play with

3. Team with other rangers. Rangers by themselves are a versatile and powerful force. Several rangers together, if played correctly, can be unstoppable. And there's always rangers waiting around to join groups. After a few frustrating tries at Thunderhead Keep, I got through it for my first time in a group of seven rangers and one monk. The monk thought we were crazy, but went along anyway, and we completely creamed the mission.

4. Team with other neglected classes. Every class has their strengths, but too many players think if you're not a warrior or a monk, you don't know what you're doing. Well, that attitude alienates a lot of other players, not just rangers. So invite a few mesmers along. Necros aren't as hated as they once were, but they're still great teammates. And with the right secondary professions and skills, maybe henchies, you don't need those other players.

Well, after you've done all this, and you finally reach Hell's Precipice, and you have Winter on hand, and other players finally want you in their group, here's what you do: don't join. Why should those who shunned you all through the game, and had no interest in helping you get that far to where you could be there to help them with the final mission benefit from your hard work? If you really want to have some fun, go through the mish, cap Greater Conflagration, go back to the staging area and spam "Ranger w/Winter and GC NOT joining groups for mission" until you've made a complete jerk of yourself (no, I don't actually recommend doing this, it's rude, but as an oft-frustrated ranger, it is fun to think about, isn't it?

).

Do I come off as a little bitter? I'm sure I do, but I think anyone who has made it through the game as a ranger is entitled to some bitterness towards those who continually snubbed them from their groups. I don't actually bear these players any malice, it's their loss for not enjoying the company of one of the most fun professions to play in the game. Maybe someday they can grow up and be rangers too